Filed under: 3rd wave feminism, Feminism, feminist mentors, male privilege, radical feminism, Uncategorized, women's studies
I know I said I won’t be posting much, but the fact is that I need to apologize. It’s been less than a week since school is back in session, and I’ve already been challenged to look at my world from a different lense. For that, I am thankful. The apology note is below.
I feel the need to apologize to all who’ve been on this blog during the past few months. It’s all my fault.
I am not making any excuses for it, but I will say this: I failed to see things from your perspetives and paradigms, and I am wrong for it. I wasn’t wrong because I didn’t see it, but because I refused to take the time to see it.
Instead of being critical at myself and my own belief systems, I became critical of the knowlege and claims of radical feminism. I held my “truth” and “values” as the only ones that could be correct, and as a privileged male, doing so only furthered my patriarchy. I took the advice to “listen to women” as meaning “submit to women,” while all along, it simply means to learn from women’s voices and experiences.
In doing so, I leaned further to the other side of the line – the one that I’d been a part of all my life. In doing so, I moved further from feminism, and deeper into the patriarchy. For that, I apologize.
The words I use and the jobs I take, while I can justify them with the way I view the world, take on a whole different meaning for women. Rather than trying to see things from women’s perspectives, I was defiant and defended my own perspective. My shots at radical feminism was based on my lack of understanding of untapped knowlege and experiences. My attack on radical feminsm was based on on the male lense, the lense of the oppressor, rather than the oppressed.
From my vantage point, I don’t see everything. I see very little because in belonging to the class that rules, rather than the one being subjugated, I DID NOT need to see a lot. I was wrong.
To truly be effective in feminism, I must not only have the values and the convictions, but also the knowlege of women’s experiences. Too often, I’ve neglected those stories and experiences when they are told to me, because in my world, individual stories are written off as meaningless. They are written off as being useless in the fight for power and control.
Know that while my convictions and values were there, my practice was not, and most of the time, it was an unconscious decision. Most of the time, it was based on my “intuition” and “instincts,” the majority of which was socially constructed based on male power.
As such, I strive to do better in the future …to share less and listen more. The paths to social activism starts with the values and convictions that all are equal, but without the knowlege of what or how to best serve women, then said values and convictions are useless.
I am working on that knowlege and I will continue to do so. Sometimes, all I need is a dose of reality – a talking-to by a feminist mentor, for me to see what I’ve done wrong.
Perhaps that’s what scares me the most …what the hell do I do when I am out of college and there are no professors for me to call and ask the critical questions? What the hell do I do when I don’t know what’s best for women? Do my professors hold all the answers, or do individual experiences of individual women matter more? Those are the questions I am still trying to answer, and in coming back to the women’s studies program this semester, I hope to answer those questions.
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America's Next Bill Clinton! 
One of the great things about forming friendships with your professors and mentors in college is that you can keep up those contacts after you leave, as well. I have one college professor that I still keep in touch with, and 2 ex-colleagues that are teachers whom I hope to pump for advice and knowledge for as long as I possibly can. The end of college doesn’t have to mean the end of having these people to help lead you through confusion.
Comment by Marcy January 19, 2008 @ 9:40 am“What the hell do I do when I don’t know what’s best for women?”
You already answered that question – “…to share less and listen more.” Knowing what’s “best” for us has some real paternal connotations there.
“Do my professors hold all the answers, or do individual experiences of individual women matter more?”
I’ve found that the most valuable thing I received from one of my professors was not just the knowledge she had to teach me, but the framework she helped me create with which to analyze the things I learn. It will definitely benefit me way past college. And if your professors held all the answers there would be no need to keep learning about these things once you left school.
Comment by Gwytherinn January 20, 2008 @ 4:12 pmMy advice:
1. Since you saw “listening to women” as meaning “submiting to women” and in light of your other comments, you are clearly not a pro-feminist male. Perhaps one day you will become one, but you are not one now. You may consider the appropriateness of referring to yourself with that label.
2. Don’t worry about deciding “what is best for women.” We do not need our oppressors deciding what is best for us, lest of all a member of the oppressor class who is still so committed to furthering patriarchy.
3. If you are upset that I am not giving you a cookie for apologizing, then you are advised to read your post again and consider what may be fueling your reaction.
Comment by shoals January 20, 2008 @ 5:43 pmI appreciate that you have given more thought to this. And I agree with your assessment re: where you were getting stuck.
Comment by SarahMC January 21, 2008 @ 1:59 amI’m a big fan of your writing for quite a while now, but I didn’t want to write any comment until I’ve read EVERYTHING that’s on this blog 🙂
Comment by ivana January 24, 2008 @ 12:45 amI think your understanding of feminism is very good (and not just feminism – it seems you’re someone who can use sound critical thinking in various human rights issues, including religious/cultural issues) and I hope you DO become president some day, and make some changes from the top 🙂
This is possibly the creepiest thing I have ever read, and I have read the SCUM manifesto.
Comment by Exposing Feminism February 21, 2008 @ 6:37 pmWell, what makes me a woman against feminism is seeing the bad deal men have been getting–plus seeing all the havoc feminism has wreaked.
Man up, nancy!
Comment by Alexandra February 21, 2008 @ 7:25 pmWhen you get out of feminist colleges you will have to become a MAN to survive. All the whiny feminist sympathizing and no-balls vomit won’t make you a man. No feminist professor ever will either. You will only be a man or a slave. It will be time to choose which you will be.
Comment by Bob February 21, 2008 @ 8:27 pm@ Profeministmale
Do you really believe what you just wrote? Women are subjugated? Men are vile oppressors?
You and every other man out there are not responsible for the bad actions of a few. You don’t have to spend the rest of your life trying to make amends for crimes you didn’t commit and things you didn’t do.
You’ve obviously spent too much time listening to the radical feminists because they’ve got you convinced that by virtue of your gender you are responsible for this terrible “oppression” women are supposed to be under.
Western women are not oppressed. They are the opposite of oppressed. All of society bends over backwards to appease, empower and make excuses for them.
If you’re interested in being a kind, compassionate individual, get out there and help those truly oppressed and in need, like the homeless, the destitute, those that are sick, old and alone. Your time would be far better served than wasting it apologizing for things you didn’t do to people who judge you, not by the caliber of your character or merits of your actions, but by your gender.
Comment by Kim February 22, 2008 @ 12:45 amErin Pizzey on KFBK talk radio (Sacramento, California)
Erin Pizzey, who founded the shelter movement for domestic violence victims in 1971, discusses the February 15, 2008 conference, “From Ideology to Inclusion” (sponsored by the CAFC) and the need to recognize research rather than ideology on just who is perpetrating and victimized by domestic violence.
Listen: http://www.cafcusa.org/multimedia/2008/02/14/pizzey.m3u
Comment by bola February 22, 2008 @ 12:48 pmGrow a pair, weakling.
Comment by Oliver February 26, 2008 @ 2:12 amAfter reading all of the above, I found it interesting that no matter what you say or do feminist act as if you have no right to even comment about feminism because you are a man. I especially liked the comment posted about you not having to apologize for being a man. However I found it interesting it is now deleted. I have to wonder why you would delete a coment that was not saying anything rude about you. Nor putting you down in anyway, but supporting you as a man with rights. The right to not feel responsible and apologize for being a man and because you are a man somehow responsible for all women’s oppression. I can only conclude like with all radical feminists and liberals when the truth or any opposing opinion is given there is no such thing as diversity and they are intolerant of anyone’s opinions that don’t match up with their own beliefs. All along claiming that everyone else is intolerant. So I have to ask why would you delete such a well spoken comment that didn’t attack you in any way, but you keep the ones that are written by radical feminist who say things like
“1. Since you saw “listening to women” as meaning “submiting to women” and in light of your other comments, you are clearly not a pro-feminist male. Perhaps one day you will become one, but you are not one now. You may consider the appropriateness of referring to yourself with that label.
2. Don’t worry about deciding “what is best for women.” We do not need our oppressors deciding what is best for us, lest of all a member of the oppressor class who is still so committed to furthering patriarchy.
3. If you are upset that I am not giving you a cookie for apologizing, then you are advised to read your post again and consider what may be fueling your reaction.”
When someone chooses to only post, or display opinions that support one side and delete post from people on the other side, you loose all credibility. Maybe you are just wanting to preach to the choir. Or maybe it was a mistake. Out of all the responses given above, I found that one (deleted) to be the best. I even saved a copy of it to share with other. So in case that was a mistake, I will put past it here. That way I can see if you are one who likes to preach to the choir and are intolerant of any apposing views or if you want real responses from both sides. I do like the one that says
“Man up, nancy!”
Here is the one that was deleted
“Do you really believe what you just wrote? Women are subjugated? Men are vile oppressors? You and every other man out there are not responsible for the bad actions of a few. You don’t have to spend the rest of your life trying to make amends for crimes you didn’t commit and things you didn’t do.
You’ve obviously spent too much time listening to the radical feminists because they’ve got you convinced that by virtue of your gender you are responsible for this terrible “oppression” women are supposed to be under.
Western women are not oppressed. They are the opposite of oppressed. All of society bends over backwards to appease, empower and make excuses for them.
If you’re interested in being a kind, compassionate individual, get out there and help those truly oppressed and in need, like the homeless, the destitute, those that are sick, old and alone. Your time would be far better served than wasting it apologizing for things you didn’t do to people who judge you, not by the caliber of your character or merits of your actions, but by your gender”
Comment by Troy February 26, 2008 @ 9:03 amWow that took all but 1 min for you to delete any opposing view. Are you sitting there with nothing else to du but delete any opposing views? I’m guessing you are clearly intolerant like all radical feminists and liberals. I feel sorry for you . So I will say it “man up” I will have to share my thought about you and your intolerance with many to show how intolerant and one sided feminism is. You should have been born a woman because you are doing all men and boys a disservice. By saying we should all feel responsible for the acts of few. That is discrimination. “Say it” but if it doesn’t go along with my lies or misguided beliefs I will delete it. You should put that on your board. At least be up front with your agenda. You are a fraud..
So here it is again. I hope you stay up all night deleting this.
After reading all of the above, I found it interesting that no matter what you say or do feminist act as if you have no right to even comment about feminism because you are a man. I especially liked the comment posted about you not having to apologize for being a man.
However I found it interesting it is now deleted. I have to wonder why you would delete a coment that was not saying anything rude about you. Nor putting you down in anyway, but supporting you as a man with rights. The right to not feel responsible and apologize for being a man and because you are a man somehow responsible for all women’s oppression.
I can only conclude like with all radical feminists and liberals when the truth or any opposing opinion is given there is no such thing as diversity and they are intolerant of anyone’s opinions that don’t match up with their own beliefs. All along claiming that everyone else is intolerant. So I have to ask why would you delete such a well spoken comment that didn’t attack you in any way, but you keep the ones that are written by radical feminist who say things like
“1. Since you saw “listening to women” as meaning “submiting to women” and in light of your other comments, you are clearly not a pro-feminist male. Perhaps one day you will become one, but you are not one now. You may consider the appropriateness of referring to yourself with that label.
2. Don’t worry about deciding “what is best for women.” We do not need our oppressors deciding what is best for us, lest of all a member of the oppressor class who is still so committed to furthering patriarchy.
3. If you are upset that I am not giving you a cookie for apologizing, then you are advised to read your post again and consider what may be fueling your reaction.”
When someone chooses to only post, or display opinions that support one side and delete post from people on the other side, you loose all credibility. Maybe you are just wanting to preach to the choir. Or maybe it was a mistake. Out of all the responses given above, I found that one (deleted) to be the best. I even saved a copy of it to share with other. So in case that was a mistake, I will put past it here. That way I can see if you are one who likes to preach to the choir and are intolerant of any apposing views or if you want real responses from both sides. I do like the one that says
“Man up, nancy!”
Here is the one that was deleted
“Do you really believe what you just wrote? Women are subjugated? Men are vile oppressors? You and every other man out there are not responsible for the bad actions of a few. You don’t have to spend the rest of your life trying to make amends for crimes you didn’t commit and things you didn’t do.
Comment by Troy February 26, 2008 @ 9:31 amYou’ve obviously spent too much time listening to the radical feminists because they’ve got you convinced that by virtue of your gender you are responsible for this terrible “oppression” women are supposed to be under.
Western women are not oppressed. They are the opposite of oppressed. All of society bends over backwards to appease, empower and make excuses for them.
If you’re interested in being a kind, compassionate individual, get out there and help those truly oppressed and in need, like the homeless, the destitute, those that are sick, old and alone. Your time would be far better served than wasting it apologizing for things you didn’t do to people who judge you, not by the caliber of your character or merits of your actions, but by your gender”
Comment by Troy February 26, 2008 @ 9:03 am
and again
Wow that took all but 1 min for you to delete any opposing view. Are you sitting there with nothing else to du but delete any opposing views? I’m guessing you are clearly intolerant like all radical feminists and liberals. I feel sorry for you . So I will say it “man up” I will have to share my thought about you and your intolerance with many to show how intolerant and one sided feminism is. You should have been born a woman because you are doing all men and boys a disservice. By saying we should all feel responsible for the acts of few. That is discrimination. “Say it” but if it doesn’t go along with my lies or misguided beliefs I will delete it. You should put that on your board. At least be up front with your agenda. You are a fraud..
So here it is again. I hope you stay up all night deleting this.
After reading all of the above, I found it interesting that no matter what you say or do feminist act as if you have no right to even comment about feminism because you are a man. I especially liked the comment posted about you not having to apologize for being a man.
However I found it interesting it is now deleted. I have to wonder why you would delete a coment that was not saying anything rude about you. Nor putting you down in anyway, but supporting you as a man with rights. The right to not feel responsible and apologize for being a man and because you are a man somehow responsible for all women’s oppression.
I can only conclude like with all radical feminists and liberals when the truth or any opposing opinion is given there is no such thing as diversity and they are intolerant of anyone’s opinions that don’t match up with their own beliefs. All along claiming that everyone else is intolerant. So I have to ask why would you delete such a well spoken comment that didn’t attack you in any way, but you keep the ones that are written by radical feminist who say things like
“1. Since you saw “listening to women” as meaning “submiting to women” and in light of your other comments, you are clearly not a pro-feminist male. Perhaps one day you will become one, but you are not one now. You may consider the appropriateness of referring to yourself with that label.
2. Don’t worry about deciding “what is best for women.” We do not need our oppressors deciding what is best for us, lest of all a member of the oppressor class who is still so committed to furthering patriarchy.
3. If you are upset that I am not giving you a cookie for apologizing, then you are advised to read your post again and consider what may be fueling your reaction.”
When someone chooses to only post, or display opinions that support one side and delete post from people on the other side, you loose all credibility. Maybe you are just wanting to preach to the choir. Or maybe it was a mistake. Out of all the responses given above, I found that one (deleted) to be the best. I even saved a copy of it to share with other. So in case that was a mistake, I will put past it here. That way I can see if you are one who likes to preach to the choir and are intolerant of any apposing views or if you want real responses from both sides. I do like the one that says
“Man up, nancy!”
Here is the one that was deleted
“Do you really believe what you just wrote? Women are subjugated? Men are vile oppressors? You and every other man out there are not responsible for the bad actions of a few. You don’t have to spend the rest of your life trying to make amends for crimes you didn’t commit and things you didn’t do.
Comment by Troy February 26, 2008 @ 9:34 amYou’ve obviously spent too much time listening to the radical feminists because they’ve got you convinced that by virtue of your gender you are responsible for this terrible “oppression” women are supposed to be under.
Western women are not oppressed. They are the opposite of oppressed. All of society bends over backwards to appease, empower and make excuses for them.
If you’re interested in being a kind, compassionate individual, get out there and help those truly oppressed and in need, like the homeless, the destitute, those that are sick, old and alone. Your time would be far better served than wasting it apologizing for things you didn’t do to people who judge you, not by the caliber of your character or merits of your actions, but by your gender”
Comment by Troy February 26, 2008 @ 9:03 am
PFM, is it true that you are deleting comments here that offer a different view of feminism to yours?
There is a discussion about it here..
http://antimisandry.com/pro_feminist_male-t9680.html?t=9680
Surely as an aspiring politician you can deflect criticism without need for censorship!
Comment by Exposing Feminism February 26, 2008 @ 6:44 pmAccording to my information you have deleted at least two perfectly decent and serious comments on your blog entry. Is this true? Is this due to a misunderstanding, a technical glitch or have you censored these comments?
Comment by bola February 26, 2008 @ 10:38 pm“Southern Ontario resident Mariel Davison offers up a rather damning story of what happens when naively impartial volunteerism collides with women’s shelter groupthink.
Davison has an honours degree in psychology. A few years ago, considering herself an “equal opportunity feminist,” she volunteered to serve at a local women’s shelter. During eight weeks’ “training,” Davison was subjected to relentless male-bashing and junk science. That, and the puzzling incongruity of the female-as-victim message with the battered lesbians who also sought refuge — lesbian violence was a taboo subject amongst trainees — led to further intellectual inquiry.
Davison thought her trove of cutting-edge findings would prove welcome, but instead they got her turfed by her peers: “I was told I had too much education to volunteer at the shelter.”
Incredulous, Davison dogged the shelter’s supervising and financing government ministries with demands that they review objective literature, but was stonewalled at every turn. Nothing came of her campaign.”
Comment by bola February 29, 2008 @ 1:07 amTroy, quit your bitching. Unlike you, I don’t just sit around and comment on people’s blogs, waiting for a reaction. I actually earn my wages, go to school and pay my bills. Your whining isn’t going to make me run over to the computer and approve your comments right away.
Plus, most of you anti-feminists don’t know shit about feminism – so shut your trap until you’ve learned something. Sure, there are feminists who are “radical,” but it doesn’t mean that feminists as a whole are “radical.”
Even at that, rather than blaming radical feminists for hating men, how about you start examining the social forces that have driven these women to be radical feminist.
Do you even know what the fuck a radical feminist is?
Alexandra – try to say something that I can respond to. How males are oppressed by feminism is still foreign to me. How about you tell us your reasons, rather than just making stupid statements like that?
Oliver – because your balls determine who you are as a person, right? For someone claiming to be so many, you surely are obsessed with balls. What gives? Pulling a little Larry Craig on us?
Exposing Feminism – You’re not exposing shit. It’s kind of important to know what a movement is before you expose it. I am sorry I don’t have time to approve every comment that comes into my inbox in a timely manner. Unlike you, I don’t have time to sit around and bitch about how women have taken away my rights.
Ivana – thanks. I am glad you found the blog. Although the anti-feminists’ comments have to get annoying at times, I am sure.
Comment by profeministmale March 13, 2008 @ 5:02 pmYou will only be a man or a slave. It will be time to choose which you will be.
That certainly was telling.
Comment by kissmypineapple March 14, 2008 @ 9:18 pm